SACHS DAMPERS REBUILDS

[Jon.G]

Just want to throw an update to my issue here:

I've spoken to Ben today and there records showed they had replaced the passenger side piston when the first went in to be refurbished. However as you can see earlier in this thread (http://www.cliosport.net/forum/show...-Clio-Trophy&p=7904228&viewfull=1#post7904228), they actually replaced the drivers side piston. I sent a load of photos to Ben showing their condition before and after with pictures of the seals, markings and the new piston (in the driver side damper).

Ben and I have come a brief conclusion that the piston was possibly replaced on the wrong damper, as he confirms that the passenger damper was not functioning when it went into them. With this in mind, he has asked me to send both dampers back to him so that they can inspect, report and repair the passenger shock and also dyno test the drivers side to ensure a good balance. Ben said as long as everything they find on the shocks backs up the theory all this work will be carried out free of charge.

The dampers should be coming off either this or next weekend depending on when I can get a set of dampers as a temporary solution until mine are back. They are booked in for the 1st of March.

Fingers crossed.

 

[bearne1]

Just want to throw an update to my issue here:

I've spoken to Ben today and there records showed they had replaced the passenger side piston when the first went in to be refurbished. However as you can see earlier in this thread (http://www.cliosport.net/forum/show...-Clio-Trophy&p=7904228&viewfull=1#post7904228), they actually replaced the drivers side piston. I sent a load of photos to Ben showing their condition before and after with pictures of the seals, markings and the new piston (in the driver side damper).

Ben and I have come a brief conclusion that the piston was possibly replaced on the wrong damper, as he confirms that the passenger damper was not functioning when it went into them. With this in mind, he has asked me to send both dampers back to him so that they can inspect, report and repair the passenger shock and also dyno test the drivers side to ensure a good balance. Ben said as long as everything they find on the shocks backs up the theory all this work will be carried out free of charge.

The dampers should be coming off either this or next weekend depending on when I can get a set of dampers as a temporary solution until mine are back. They are booked in for the 1st of March.

Fingers crossed.

Good work, hope you get it sorted!

Mine just had a standard service the first time round so will be interesting to find out what has failed. But be useful if we all got some sort of report both before and after the service, that way we know what is being done.

 

[Jon.G]

More than likely it has failed because the piston is scored, thats why it was being replaced the first time. However as it was never replaced, it has failed again. Obviously some pressure has been lost from the shock due to the scored piston.

 

[bearne1]

Doesn't Paul Drake at Gould Engineering (I think) do them if it is a straightforward service that is required? I recall seeing something in the region of £100 per side earlier in this thread.
I reckon there are loads of other motorsport companies that could do this service, it's just that no-one has had the time/energy to visit one and actually talk to someone about it.
Total Control Racing in West Mids prep Clio Cup cars (including Nicolas Hamilton's), they must know someone who can rebuild race-spec suspension or even do it themselves.
If it was circa £100 per side, I wouldn't mind getting them done every couple of years as a matter of routine maintenance but at £500 plus, you'd pretty much expect them to have the integrity of a new one.

I have my spare set requiring a refurb and am wondering whether to try Paul Drake or someone else just for the hell of it to see what they can do.

Unfortunately Gould are unable to help:

Sorry Dan,

We don't service dampers (and we never have).

All the best, David

 

[bearne1]

On the other side of the coin - has anyone had their dampers refurbed pre 2010 and not had any 'issues'?

 

[bearne1]

Also have a contact at AST UK I may be speaking to next week (been recommended by a friend who is studying British Motor Sport Engineering) so will see what transpires. Still getting mine serviced with BG on the 29th Feb but really want some backup in the future if things go wrong again.

After a quick scan of the internet - also found this: http://www.gmsustech.co.uk/services.htm

Thoughts?

 

[Carbon Chaos]

Not only is the price rising but i cant believe they don't guarantee the work for at least 12 months,thought this was the norm?

 

[bearne1]

Not only is the price rising but i cant believe they don't guarantee the work for at least 12 months,thought this was the norm?

Ben at BG advised that the dampers are received as 'used' and in essence a service is only the same as if your engine is serviced.

A warranty would certainly help but from their point of view you could drive the car as hard as you wanted for a year when something is likely to fail due to excess stress, etc. Would be interesting to see how a 3rd party warranty company would handle such claim for a failed damper (just a thought I had as may be cost effective way to get a new pair of dampers).

I think the issue here is the lack of competition in servicing these dampers, as we can only trust what BG are saying by word of mouth!

As per my previous messages, if would be interesting to know exactly what work is carried out to each damper, how long the service takes and what parts were replaced.

 

[MarcB]

Got these e-mails from zf (Sachs) today.

Hi Marc.
*
Sachs only ever supplied these shocks to Renault as oe parts they have never been released to us in the aftermarket.
*
The sachs race engineering products are very good but we have no info on them, even though they are part of our company we are unable to buy these products.
*
BG motorsport are sachs race engineering sales partner for shocks in the uk but as they are not a customer of ours I cannot tell you anything about them only what you already know from the internet.
*
I am *not sure about warranty you would have to contact BG motorsport on that one and the same on the stickers
*
Sorry I cannot be of more help
*
Craig Pearson

------------------


Marc
*
As I stated in my first email we are unable to purchase any sachs race engineering parts they are a separate part of the zf business.
*
There are lots of politics and reasons for this but they dictate this to us.
*
We have been asked numerous times in the past for these shocks but they were only ever produced for renault and we have been asked for the stickers as well and we had the same answer.
*
If you get them reworked by bg motorsport they may be able to get the stickers but I would be surprised if you will get them and as far as im aware bg motorsport is the only sachs race engineering
*
sales agent for shocks in the uk
*
Regards
*
Craig

 

[Carbon Chaos]

So you take your 'used' pc in for repair and they fix it,they also give you a 12 month guarantee on 'their' work.

This is a standard practice imo BG should do similar as peace of mind. just my views

 

[MarcB]

Right im now on a mission to find the contact details for this man in the video

[video=youtube;t0TVTRaAFSg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0TVTRaAFSg[/video]

Also found there facebook page

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Sachs-Performance/179305822083454?sk=info

Also found this website as there seems to be so many different divisions of the ZF / Sachs group

http://www.sachsperformance.com/Contact:_:7.html

And while i hunt these people down on the interweb im rather sure that there is something about warrenty / guarantees on the trading standards website which im going to look into

 

[MarcB]

[h=1]Vehicle repairs and servicing[/h]
(for England, Wales and Northern Ireland)
Enter your postcode in the field at the bottom of this page to see if your local authority trading standards department has the full leaflet version available on its website.
When you take your car to a garage for servicing or repair, you are making a legally binding contract with the garage owner and the laws you can look to for protection are the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 and the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002. These laws give you statutory rights and you are entitled to expect that the work be carried out with reasonable care and skill, within a reasonable time at a reasonable charge. If a part is replaced, the new part should be of satisfactory quality, fit for the purpose and as described.
If a fault has not been repaired properly, you should allow the garage the chance to rectify it. If they fail to do so, you may be entitled to get the work done elsewhere and recover the cost from the garage. If the garage fits a part, which turns out to be faulty, and it has not been fitted very long, you may be entitled to a refund, or you could ask for the part to be replaced. If you pay for the servicing or repairs by credit card, and if the work costs more than £100, you are protected by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 which makes the credit card company equally liable. It is a criminal offence to charge for work which has not been carried out and any such complaints should be forwarded to Consumer Direct (new website).




http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/advice/problemswithvehicles-sum2.cfm

 

[bearne1]

Some interesting info there MarcR - could be opening a can of worms here but will be interesting to see if we get any leads.


Hope some do not take some of these messages the wrong way - just to me a £500 pound charge for a service that does not last more than a couple of years does not feel value for money in my eyes. Have not yet given chance for BG to actually inspect and repair the dampers and work out what they will be charging me.

Happy to give somebody a second chance but would be very concerned if things are the same in the very near future.

 

[Jon.G]

At first I was very I take this matter extremely seriously and am looking hard into how this could of possibly happened. annoyed about how my damper has failed, however after talking to mark I believe that he is offering his best service to rectify my problem (and anybody else's). [FONT=Eurostile, sans-serif]I am filled with confidence that Mark will do his up most to ensure that the service he originally provided is followed through.

It has been seen in a few cases of failed dampers after servicing that Mark has either paid part or fully for a fresh refurbish of the said failed damper, which are his and our rights.

I obviously was annoyed at first, but I don't want it to seem as if I am slating the work they do as they are profession and their turn around time is excellent.

Bearne1, My dampers will be there at the same time as yours. As they are booked in for the 1st.

Some good information from Marc there, all I would say is don't go in guns blazing if you have issues. Approch Mark with you issues and he'll advise what he can do, he is a friendly and professional person. He is offering you a professional service not many others can do.

I'll keep the trading standards info in mind for when Ben gets back to me. [/FONT]

 

[bearne1]

Jon - some very reassuring words there.

Have hit jackpot with a backup plan, have someone who is willing to look at my dampers for me. This may complicate things at this stage but there is someone on here who has a spare set they may be willing to send to this guy (who knows BG well) so will speak to him direct.

Thanks

 

[bearne1]

Managed to get my dampers off before the rain and decided to get my mechanic to loosen the top mount bolts to avoid a struggle!

You will see that one of the damper's piston is lower, it does not retract to its usual position so my suspicion of the car being slightly tilted was right. The piston when pushed in makes a horrible slushing noise and is rather soft so imagine it is shot. The cause at this stage I have no idea so will wait to hear from BG.

Have looked at the offside damper and that seems fine to me with a hard strong pressure.

Here's hoping that they are fixed promptly to get the car back on the road. With the front end wear items all replaced it should be a hell of a ride when complete.

 

[Jon.G]

Your's don't look as bad as my fucked one.. Have a look at my post on CS:
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/show...-Clio-Trophy&p=8459051&viewfull=1#post8459051

 

[bearne1]

Your's don't look as bad as my fucked one.. Have a look at my post on CS:
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/show...-Clio-Trophy&p=8459051&viewfull=1#post8459051

Crikey thought mine were bad!

Does your passenger side one make a nasty noise when you push the piston down?

 

[Jon.G]

Exactly as you described it, slushy and soft.

I'd be a tenner you'll need a new piston in there. That why mines gone again, because the piston wasn't replaced.

Your's might just be repairable as it doesn't look as severe as mine.

What happened to your stickers BTW?

 

[bearne1]

Exactly as you described it, slushy and soft.

I'd be a tenner you'll need a new piston in there. That why mines gone again, because the piston wasn't replaced.

Your's might just be repairable as it doesn't look as severe as mine.

What happened to your stickers BTW?

An expensive job expected then! Hope mine are not too bad, will have to see.

Stickers were very faded so they were removed after first service. Decided to get a brand new set of rears and smeared them in grease before fitting so hopefully they will remain in top condition.

Check my arches and remove wheels regularly and never seen any fluid before so hopefully the leak is fresh.