Aftermarket exhausts - 2.5 inch dia cat back pointless?

[is1]

I agree the BTB is expensive, but i would say that the scorpion isnt perfect where i would imagine the BTB is. My scorpion definately needed a few alterations to make it sit properly aligned, Marrow will back me up that it was hanging far too low previously.

Other than that great exhaust 8) Oh and it seems to develop a leak after about 5 weeks of driving :twisted: (why its gonna go JMS)

Mmmmm ...
You and BenG have had reliability issues with the RS 192 (amongst others I believe). That is too often for me I'm afraid.
I really want a centre silencer though.
So if KTec and RS 192 are out, I think I will probably go with a Yozza with centre silencer in that case. Will probably still be a couple of hundred quid cheaper than a BTB and believe me, I have seen the weld quality on a Yozza at close hand!
If the sound it makes could be "muffled" a touch (hence centre silencer), we are talking perfection.

 

[Jonc]

I've had the Scorpion RS192 fitted by myself almost 3 years ago and I've had no problems and I believe one of the first to have one fitted to a Trophy :mrgreen: . If it's leaking, then not enough fire gum/high temp silcone had been applied to the joins. It's still sitting in the same position in the cutouts from the day I fitted it.

I did a guide for the RS192 here:
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5723

 

[Sir_Dave]

I saw an RS192 last night where the welds had split on the centre box.

TBh, compared to my BTB (which we then compared up on the ramp), it looked like it had been welded by this chap.

 

[Sam_K]

I've had the Scorpion RS192 fitted by myself almost 3 years ago and I've had no problems and I believe one of the first to have one fitted to a Trophy :mrgreen: . If it's leaking, then not enough fire gum/high temp silcone had been applied to the joins. It's still sitting in the same position in the cutouts from the day I fitted it.

I did a guide for the RS192 here:
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5723

Yes I remember seeing this when i purchased mine

TBH the leaking issues have mainly arised since putting a decat on, I bought it 2nd hand so may be a duff one??dont know. Believe me there is enough silicone on there!!

I agree the BTB is expensive, but i would say that the scorpion isnt perfect where i would imagine the BTB is. My scorpion definately needed a few alterations to make it sit properly aligned, Marrow will back me up that it was hanging far too low previously.

Other than that great exhaust 8) Oh and it seems to develop a leak after about 5 weeks of driving :twisted: (why its gonna go JMS)

Mmmmm ...
You and BenG have had reliability issues with the RS 192 (amongst others I believe). That is too often for me I'm afraid.
I really want a centre silencer though.
So if KTec and RS 192 are out, I think I will probably go with a Yozza with centre silencer in that case. Will probably still be a couple of hundred quid cheaper than a BTB and believe me, I have seen the weld quality on a Yozza at close hand!
If the sound it makes could be "muffled" a touch (hence centre silencer), we are talking perfection.

I think BenG's was just a freak occurence since it is the only one I have heard of to fail like this. I have had to modify the rear hangers slightly to make the exhaust sit a little higher but pre decat it was fine (leaking wise).

 

[Sam_K]

Ok 2nd RS192 with split in it!!!

 

[hoolio]

I saw an RS192 last night where the welds had split on the centre box.

TBh, compared to my BTB (which we then compared up on the ramp), it looked like it had been welded by this chap.

Bet it sounded sweet though!

 

[Adam Trophy 37]

Just another point of view I have the Ktec ultra performance without the centre silencer about 3 months now. Fitted fine no probs sounds lush Many ppl have commented it doesn't sound anything like the standard one I'd say they got the noise level just right, for normal driving u get a powerful smooth sound and wen u put ur boot down it really growls. Given it only cost 380 I think it's good value. plus not had any leaks yet!

 

[OliS]

Am I missing something?
The BTB is circa £700-800 whereas a Scorpion RS 192 is £350. Both claim 5-6 bhp gain (RS 192 with printouts) but the Scorpion has a centre pipe so will, without a doubt, be the better choice in the long run from a noise point of view. It is also lighter (than the standard exhaust at least) and has a lifetime guarantee.
Scorpion build quality is not known to be poor is it? I have had one on another car and it was great. I appreciate it may not be a work of art but it's an exhaust after all.

I agree...

I wasn't considering the Scopion because of a couple of threads on this forum, one details a defect, another had a 6 week delivery wait. Along with the not so positive posts in this thread, it makes it too much of a risk for me.

Another thing I'm looking for is for a single garage to take responsibility for the supply and fitting of the exhaust, so if I do have any problems there is no discussion of who is responsible for it. I'll happily tweak, adjust and fix leaks if there are any, but I want the peace of mind that if anything goes wrong, I can just take my car back to them.

 

[Sir_Dave]

Another thing I'm looking for is for a single garage to take responsibility for the supply and fitting of the exhaust, so if I do have any problems there is no discussion of who is responsible for it. I'll happily tweak, adjust and fix leaks if there are any, but I want the peace of mind that if anything goes wrong, I can just take my car back to them.

JMS can supply & fit the BTB (& others im sure) and are based in Chertsey if thats any good to you

Not sure if they are officially promoting it yet, but they were fitting one when i collected my car the other day. Just say that Dave recommended you.

They're on holiday until Tuesday, but contactable after that.

 

[OliS]

JMS can supply & fit the BTB (& others im sure) and are based in Chertsey if thats any good to you

Not sure if they are officially promoting it yet, but they were fitting one when i collected my car the other day. Just say that Dave recommended you.

Thanks for the heads up Dave, and yes Chertsey would be much better for me than missioning up to Daventry, but one of the guys I currently work with used to work for Jo at BTB (when Jo was running a BTCC team) and he's kind of arranged for the two of us to go up and see Jo to get my exhaust fitted... Such is life, someone does you a favour and it ends up being more hassle than if you sort things out yourself!

 

[Sam_K]

Dave did you see anything of the new RS2 when you were there?

 

[Sir_Dave]

Dave did you see anything of the new RS2 when you were there?

Yup, there's lot of parts currently being collated. As far as im aware, the build process will be starting when they get back from Skiing on Tuesday. Only problem is, with the usual service work and over 25 (!!!) RS2's to build, i cant imagine it being something thats going to get turned around within a few days lol ...

 

[Sam_K]

Yea I can imagine they are very busy, been looking forward to have mine fitted for ages so really want it booked in now lol!!

Once again sorry for the thread hijack OliS!

 

[FunkyMunky]

I've got a Prospeed fitted, with the cat mod done by Charlie too... quality exhaust and less boomy than a lot of the other stuff out there, bloody massive trek to Cardiff to get it done mind you but i'd highly recommend one over an off the shelf jobbie... bit cheaper than a BTB too

 

[PAGANI]

I have had an RS192 fitted for almost one year and had no problems with it, never had to adjust it, it's not the loudest but i do some motorway miles, gonna have to get the cat removed cause am getting the RS2 manifold fitted because scorpian don't do a sports cat. Has anyone had a custom sports cat made up for the 192? Getting the right exhaust to suit you can be difficult and expensive if you don't like it and have to change it.

 

[OliS]

Thanks for comments FM and Pagani, but in the end I decided to go down the BTB route. Had it fitted yesterday, already covered just under 200 miles since and I am a very happy lad indeed!

Had the cat modified too, so now 2.5 dia from the end of the manifold to the split for the backboxes. Sounds mega on full throttle especially when closing in on the red line, didn't find it too boomy at motorway speeds, but I do find it quite noisy in and around town pootling about in the lower rev range, but could forgive it most things for the fully charging sound!

Looks gorgeous too (the welding is a work of art), I know you've all seen one before but I'll add some pics to my garage when I've got time.

So to answer my original question, 2.5 inch cat back exhausts aren't pointless, they are blooming marvelous! Not sure I'd get one without modifying the cat though...

 

[marrow]

I'd be surprised if it was better looking than the above Prospeed?

 

[spitfire]

I'm off to see Charlie at Prospeed myself this coming Saturday, as my left back box has finally started to blow. Will be getting a cat back system, as I can't be bothered with the decat faff come MoT time. Not looking forward to all those motorway miles in 415, but I am sure that the end result will be well worth it. Have yet to read any negative comments about the Prospeed system on here or the Clio forum

 

[j333evo]

I'd be surprised if it was better looking than the above Prospeed?

The external looks are not much different, but the way it's constructed is very different.

The Prospeed above has a single entry to one back box which then splits into two tailpipes.

The BTB is more like the OEM system where it splits further downstream and goes into separaterback boxesoxes which is a more direct path to take as it does not force the exhaust gases to do 90degree turn, then a 180 after the backbox then a further 90degree to the tail pipes.

I'm no expert but, I'd think the BTB will flow much better and give better performance gains, though will be more expensive to manufacture as a result of having the twin boxes. The price differance over a BTB 172 systems is testament to this.

Would anyone feel the difference, probably not, as the total increase by either would be smallish.

I have seen the production facilities at BTB as my father in law got the prototype 500Abarth system built there including boost controlled backbox bypass valve, and they are very good.

On back to back power runs on same rolling road owned by guy Jon used to work with at Cosworth, it produced some 19lb ft more torque peak 500rpm lower than before, with more than 10lb ft available everywhere over a 3500rpm spread, and peak power increase of 5bhp at first seems low, but its the torque that really makes the difference, especially on a small capacity turbo car.

Joe the proprietor was very open about his products, happy to discuss the exhaust system as I asked about the 182 system plus CAT mod, and he openly said that a guy he builds systems for his hill climb Clio said car was much more drivable after cat mod, with better pickup, & freer delivery top end, yet it actually showed a slight drop in peak power & torque on r/r run which totally contradicted how it performed in competition.

 

[OliS]

I'd be surprised if it was better looking than the above Prospeed?

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder no? I'm sure FM and all the other prospeed owners love their exhausts just like I love mine... it isn't a competition! :lol:

The BTB does look and sound gorgeous though, I'm so made up with my purchase, every drive is even more of an event now, I'd even say that every walk to my Trophy is more of an event, jeez how sad do I sound?!?