Clio 200
- Thread starter pete g
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I drove one just before selling my T, my (very) brief description would be that it handles extremely well has more grip than a trophy is built very well stops very well but ultimately for me the Trophy is so so much more 'fun' when getting back into the trophy on the way home it just felt so much more alive and playful.
I bought a Megane R26 once i sold my T, it, like the trophy also feels very alive when driving spiritedly but i must say i do seriously regret selling the T #-o (trophysmall)
Gman
Edited to add:
Don't get me wrong I don't think the 200 cup is a bad car in anyway at all, in fact i did really enjoy driving it and would love to take one on track but the Trophy was just so perfect for what i enjoy from driving.
I bought a Megane R26 once i sold my T, it, like the trophy also feels very alive when driving spiritedly but i must say i do seriously regret selling the T #-o (trophysmall)
Gman
Edited to add:
Don't get me wrong I don't think the 200 cup is a bad car in anyway at all, in fact i did really enjoy driving it and would love to take one on track but the Trophy was just so perfect for what i enjoy from driving.
A certain person whose screen name is of a vegetable nature is apparently down to test drive one shortly; hopefully he'll post his views. Personally they've grown on me a great deal and I'm intrigued to find out what they're like to drive, but am certainly not in a position to invest in one right now..
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Cheers guys, only 2 of you..?
Not driven one either, local dealer has one but not keen to register yet and its full fat so not what I would really want.
I quite like the look, think its a grower but that does not really matter to me.
Plus points relative to CT are as Gman states; Brakes, grip, build (maybe?) better aero as well.
Downsides are; Size and weight (I like little cars!) and that electric power steering thats improved over the 197 but will never have the feel of the 182 hydraulic system.
On the track it would probably be tad quicker on a quick flowing one, bit slower on a tight one....
Decisions desicions...
Not driven one either, local dealer has one but not keen to register yet and its full fat so not what I would really want.
I quite like the look, think its a grower but that does not really matter to me.
Plus points relative to CT are as Gman states; Brakes, grip, build (maybe?) better aero as well.
Downsides are; Size and weight (I like little cars!) and that electric power steering thats improved over the 197 but will never have the feel of the 182 hydraulic system.
On the track it would probably be tad quicker on a quick flowing one, bit slower on a tight one....
Decisions desicions...
I believe that said person who was lined up to test drive is now due to do so today.. Watch this space..? :?:
Agree on many of your points - small cars with lots of feeling are certainly fun. After owning the T; getting back into my old Ka some time ago, I realised how organic it felt. Conversely, my g/f's Mini Cooper doesn't have anything like the steering feel that either the T or Ka have, but the handling is great - a good balance of stiffness vs comfort (it's running the 'S' 17s and run flats) and bags of grip - had great fun chasing Marrow's T one evening.
One thing's for sure, if they brought out a limited run 'Trophy-esque' 200 which received such excellent praise, then I would head straight to the dealers to test it. - I have grown to really value the limited nature of the T and although it wouldn't be a necessity, it's certainly a plus point in any future purchase (in my eyes)..
Agree on many of your points - small cars with lots of feeling are certainly fun. After owning the T; getting back into my old Ka some time ago, I realised how organic it felt. Conversely, my g/f's Mini Cooper doesn't have anything like the steering feel that either the T or Ka have, but the handling is great - a good balance of stiffness vs comfort (it's running the 'S' 17s and run flats) and bags of grip - had great fun chasing Marrow's T one evening.
One thing's for sure, if they brought out a limited run 'Trophy-esque' 200 which received such excellent praise, then I would head straight to the dealers to test it. - I have grown to really value the limited nature of the T and although it wouldn't be a necessity, it's certainly a plus point in any future purchase (in my eyes)..
I was underwhelmed by the 200 i drove. Point to point i'm sure it's just as quick - but as gman said it's just not as alive, and when all i do is point and squirt don b-roads, i want some thing that puts the biggest smile on my face - and for me nothing has come close to the t for that.
Although i would love the 200 brakes on the T. WOW. 8)
Although i would love the 200 brakes on the T. WOW. 8)
I had a very brief drive of a non-cup one this evening. 1st impressions not great.... I think the T looks and sounds much better, the interior is nicer and the steering feels more natural. However, the 200 does have better brakes and the gearbox is ultra close.
There are talks of a 200 Gordini which is meant to be just a fully loaded version, as opposed to a 200 Trophy.
If you are looking for a new 200, it is possible to buy a brand new cup (with no options) for £13200 otr, which is somewhat of a bargain these days.
There are talks of a 200 Gordini which is meant to be just a fully loaded version, as opposed to a 200 Trophy.
If you are looking for a new 200, it is possible to buy a brand new cup (with no options) for £13200 otr, which is somewhat of a bargain these days.
^ ^ There was a link.. :-s
I drove a Cup around Bedford Autodrome at the Renaultsport trackday in August.
I have to agree with the majority of the comments. There was nothing really wrong with the car, it was certainly more planted than the Trophy but that also meant it felt quite stale and didn't really leave any impression on me other than I wanted to do some more laps in the Trophy! It didn't feel any faster either (perhaps that was just because it was more planted) although I think Evo has it about 2.1secs faster than Trophy around Bedford.
I also found the controls to be too light (throttle, clutch, steering) so wasn't as much feedback as in the Trophy.
I have to agree with the majority of the comments. There was nothing really wrong with the car, it was certainly more planted than the Trophy but that also meant it felt quite stale and didn't really leave any impression on me other than I wanted to do some more laps in the Trophy! It didn't feel any faster either (perhaps that was just because it was more planted) although I think Evo has it about 2.1secs faster than Trophy around Bedford.
I also found the controls to be too light (throttle, clutch, steering) so wasn't as much feedback as in the Trophy.
I think Matt Wills' user name on here is Matt Wills. 7MAT is a different Matt. The one who worked with Mark Fish on the Trophy suspension and started i4detailing. 
yes, two different people - Matt Wills has the carbon bonnet... Pinkey or something is the cars name
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eSIMZ5Z6vI
Just spotted this on Youtube. Plato compares 200 and 182!
Just spotted this on Youtube. Plato compares 200 and 182!
I took a 200 out for a 45 minute test drive and it was enough to convince me to sell my Trophy and get one.
Build quality is hugely better than the 182, the driving position and gearchange are in a difficult league, the steering has plenty of feel and has the big benefit of being far quicker than the T, which means you don't need to wind as much lock on to get the nose tucked into a bend (also means you can be faster on the opposite lock).
The engine pulls very nicely from low revs right through to the beep and flashlight of the rev limiter - in a straight line it will take a Trophy any day - the wider tyres and independent axis front suspension destroying the older car for grip.
It is bigger and heavier for sure and consequently it loses a little of the Trophy's chuckability, but the upside is increased stability, improved ride and far better wheel control when the road gets bumpy. The extra width will also make it far more predictable on lift off oversteer because the rear end won't hop around like the trophy does. For me the extra size is a real plus point from a practicality viewpoint as well - finally I will be able to put people in the back!
As someone else already mentioned the brakes are awesome - I didn't have a chance to really work them on the test route but the initial bite at the top of the pedal is very confidence inspiring.
The Trophy will always be a bit special because it's a limited edition and the motoring press have secured it's place as one of the best hot hatches of all time. For me though the brittle build quality, floppy gearchange and poor driving position are starting to show its age now, and the 200 is the future...
Build quality is hugely better than the 182, the driving position and gearchange are in a difficult league, the steering has plenty of feel and has the big benefit of being far quicker than the T, which means you don't need to wind as much lock on to get the nose tucked into a bend (also means you can be faster on the opposite lock).
The engine pulls very nicely from low revs right through to the beep and flashlight of the rev limiter - in a straight line it will take a Trophy any day - the wider tyres and independent axis front suspension destroying the older car for grip.
It is bigger and heavier for sure and consequently it loses a little of the Trophy's chuckability, but the upside is increased stability, improved ride and far better wheel control when the road gets bumpy. The extra width will also make it far more predictable on lift off oversteer because the rear end won't hop around like the trophy does. For me the extra size is a real plus point from a practicality viewpoint as well - finally I will be able to put people in the back!
As someone else already mentioned the brakes are awesome - I didn't have a chance to really work them on the test route but the initial bite at the top of the pedal is very confidence inspiring.
The Trophy will always be a bit special because it's a limited edition and the motoring press have secured it's place as one of the best hot hatches of all time. For me though the brittle build quality, floppy gearchange and poor driving position are starting to show its age now, and the 200 is the future...
Interesting post MadUsa1... I agree with most of of your points, apart from the following:
1. for me the 200 didn't feel that quick, certainly no quicker in a straight line than the T
2. the T doesn't make a particularly amazing noise but the 200 sounded even worse
3. the steering felt artificial compared to the T
4. the gearbox although more robust are far too close
5. the T has near perfect proportions and looks the business, whilst the 200 needs a facelift!
6. the interior styling of the 200 is a step-backwards for me and the quality is no better than the T
I'm sure with time the 200 would prove to be a very good car, and who knows, maybe a slightly better allrounder for some people.
Do you have the 200 with or without Cup? Some say the Cup is too hard for day-to-driving. I drove the non-Cup and it didn't seem as go kart-like as the T.
1. for me the 200 didn't feel that quick, certainly no quicker in a straight line than the T
2. the T doesn't make a particularly amazing noise but the 200 sounded even worse
3. the steering felt artificial compared to the T
4. the gearbox although more robust are far too close
5. the T has near perfect proportions and looks the business, whilst the 200 needs a facelift!
6. the interior styling of the 200 is a step-backwards for me and the quality is no better than the T
I'm sure with time the 200 would prove to be a very good car, and who knows, maybe a slightly better allrounder for some people.
Do you have the 200 with or without Cup? Some say the Cup is too hard for day-to-driving. I drove the non-Cup and it didn't seem as go kart-like as the T.
Mine arrives in the third week of january so I'll be able to say for sure then. I went for a GW with Cup chassis, recaro, black speedlines, luxe pack, spoiler, steering lights, tinted windows.
I found the accelleration and noise of the 200 far better than the T, but we'll probably have to agree to disagree on that one! I especially enjoyed the burbly grunt on downshift blips. Maybe the one you tried still needed a bit of losening up?
I understand what you mean about the steering, it is different. It doesn't writhe around in your hands like it does in the T, but that's mainly because it has the clever independent steering axis, nothing actually to do with steering feel. Steering feel is about the steering weighting up in the corner and telegraphing the losing and regaining of grip in the bend, which the 200 does beautifully.
For me the gearchange is pretty perfect; close at hand and very positive in action. What do you mean when you say it's too close?
The look of the thing divides opinion of course, personally I love it, but I can see why people are a bit sceptical. Must say I still love the way the T looks.
Surely you can't be serious about the interior - the 200 looks awesome inside, is built like a proper modern car and has enough toys (recaros, yellow rev counter) to make it feel special.
I found the accelleration and noise of the 200 far better than the T, but we'll probably have to agree to disagree on that one! I especially enjoyed the burbly grunt on downshift blips. Maybe the one you tried still needed a bit of losening up?
I understand what you mean about the steering, it is different. It doesn't writhe around in your hands like it does in the T, but that's mainly because it has the clever independent steering axis, nothing actually to do with steering feel. Steering feel is about the steering weighting up in the corner and telegraphing the losing and regaining of grip in the bend, which the 200 does beautifully.
For me the gearchange is pretty perfect; close at hand and very positive in action. What do you mean when you say it's too close?
The look of the thing divides opinion of course, personally I love it, but I can see why people are a bit sceptical. Must say I still love the way the T looks.
Surely you can't be serious about the interior - the 200 looks awesome inside, is built like a proper modern car and has enough toys (recaros, yellow rev counter) to make it feel special.
Recaros are not even standard and a yellow rev counter is not my idea of luxury. And as for the bleep to change gear, I think a bit naff.
Gearbox is too close - it's too easy to select the wrong gear, as EVO found out at Bedford when they selected 1st and not 3rd = new gearbox. But I'm sure I could get used to it.
The 200 I drove was quite new so was probably the reason is felt slow.
GW with black wheels is a nice combo.
Good luck with the new car. Will be interested to read how you get on with it.
Gearbox is too close - it's too easy to select the wrong gear, as EVO found out at Bedford when they selected 1st and not 3rd = new gearbox. But I'm sure I could get used to it.
The 200 I drove was quite new so was probably the reason is felt slow.
GW with black wheels is a nice combo.
Good luck with the new car. Will be interested to read how you get on with it.