2118s

[Will#I#Ams]

just need to wait for the floods to stop now....

 

[marrow]

quite a busy looking wheel IMO... maybe they will look better on the car

can you get the original turinis in a 15"?

 

[Will#I#Ams]

they cant look much worse than the wheels that are on at the mo tbh mate lol. they are in desperate need of a refurb. (the turinis that is) i think these are about as close as you can get in 15s to the turinis though arent they??

less that £600 all in for all wheels/tyres too, cheaper than a refurb and new tyres, and get the new wheelbolts thrown in for free too.bonus

 

[Will#I#Ams]

 

[Gordon]

Cool. Although they look a tiny bit small in the arches and aren't as aesthetically pleasing as the standard Turini's in my view.

Yet the fact they are on PE2's over PS3's and are cheaper, and many say that 1*2's on 15" wheels are great, making little overall difference to the handling (mostly to the positive); this should be good.

Let us know if there is any noticeable difference in acceleration with a smaller rolling radius, or if the speedometer seems any different.

Looking forward to hearing your feedback on what PE2's on 15" are like for the overall handling. Enjoy scrubbing them in.

 

[Will#I#Ams]

pe2s on 15s are what im used to mate. lol.. had michelins since the hx's wore out on the williams. pilot exalto, then pe2's. the ride is far comfier than the 16s, not really had a chance to point them down any decent roads yet, massive flooding all around here yesterday means the roads are....errrr....1/2 missing in some places. lol. and yeah they look a bit lost in the arches, much like the 16s there though imho, the trophys ride far too high for me. it will be getting dropped a bit when i make my mind up what im going to do about the suspension.

i only had a quick 70-80 mile run down the motorway today, but...it kept another williams on the road so im happy. altho the steering response does seem a little sharper, and im feeling a bit more confidant at throwing it round the roundabouts, but that could be due to the michys rather than the cheap shit tyres that were on it. lol


and the 2 together

 

[marrow]

keep the feedback coming... visually the turinis are top dog

 

[Gordon]

Positive initial feedback then, although, as you say it could be a lot about changing from the no name rubbish that were on the Turini's to the PE2's on the 2118's.

If I recall others generally felt that the PE2 turn in was far sharper than PS3. Theoretically you could be noticing a positive sharp turn in again due to the PE2's.

A lot is going to be subjective of course. Ideally you need to find another friendly T near you still running the Turini's on PS3's or PE2's and drive them back to back to evaluate the real difference. Both running the standard Sach's set up as well.

I agree with Marrow, visually the Turnin's definitely have it.

It might be my imagination or an optical illusion, but with tyres fitted the Turini's look like they have a slightly larger circumference than the 2118's in your photo.

Is there much/any difference in circumference if you lay them flat and stack them on top of each other?

 

[hoolio]

It might be my imagination or an optical illusion, but with tyres fitted the Turini's look like they have a slightly larger circumference than the 2118's in your photo.

Is there much/any difference in circumference if you lay them flat and stack them on top of each other?

Not quite sure what you are getting at with that as with different diameters they are bound to have a different circumference;
15xPi = 47
16xPi = 50

 

[hoolio]

Or are you talking about the aspect ratio? But then the ratio on the15's would have to be much greater to get anywhere near the original 16's anyway. Or am I getting this really wrong? (Raging cold and trying to watch footie at the same time does nowt for the concentration)

 

[Will#I#Ams]

well, according to online calcs...too many beers after the poor england showing at mo....there is a rolling circ diff of 45 mm, and a static radius diff of 8mm

tbf i dont think theres much diff in overall height from 1 to the other, if the wheels are put side by side stood up. as they would be on the car. not enough to make a definate diff to the eye at a quick glance like.

but overall, comfort is vastly improved, turn in is far more responsive, it doesnt do that shitty wheel judder on full lock at low speed, as iv seen a lot of people asking if its normal, mine did this also, not any more, so all round, id say they are a big improvement on what was on there. like you say tho, id have to get brand new pe2s in 16" fitment on my car to make direct comparisons...which i cant do as , as im sure your aware, the pe2s are no longer available in 16 inch fitment. but im happy, the car feels much better, and theres less tramlining too. which is a good thing with the roads round here. lol

 

[Will#I#Ams]

 

[Gordon]

Not quite sure what you are getting at with that as with different diameters they are bound to have a different circumference;
15xPi = 47
16xPi = 50

Apologies if I wasn't clear Cue. I'm talking about rolling circumference. The distance it takes for one complete rotation of the wheel to be completed. Related to rolling radius, the distance from the middle of the wheel to the ground.

Or are you talking about the aspect ratio? But then the ratio on the15's would have to be much greater to get anywhere near the original 16's anyway.

No, but I completely agree, the aspect ratio of the tyres on the 15's has to be greater to maintain the OEM rolling radius.

well, according to online calcs...too many beers after the poor england showing at mo....there is a rolling circ diff of 45 mm, and a static radius diff of 8mm

Good to know. What size are the PE2's you put on the 15's? 195/50 R15, 205/50 R15 or other dimensions? Camskill list multiple sizes, some of which are out of stock.

http://www.camskill.co.uk/m53b985s0..._TYRES_CAR_MICHELIN_EXALTO2_PILOT_EXALTO_2_-_

Lastly, I presume the width of the 15's you fitted is 7x15?

There's a handy calculator for working out differences in wheel and tyre sizes here:

http://www.club80-90syncro.co.uk/Syncro_website/TechnicalPages/TRC calculator.htm

like you say tho, id have to get brand new pe2s in 16" fitment on my car to make direct comparisons...which i cant do as , as im sure your aware, the pe2s are no longer available in 16 inch fitment.

Would be interesting to see if a PS3 on 16's comparison could be done to PE2's on 15's.

 

[Will#I#Ams]

They are 195/50s mate. I found them to have a slightly sharper turn in compared to the 185/55s on the Williams. Bit made the ride a little stiffer, the higher sidewalls of the 185s absorbing more of the bumps. Yes they are 15 x7s. They are the palmersport versions, not entirely sure what the difference is tba lol. Would be good to get a comparison of the pe3s/pe2s in 15 & 16 respectively, in both 195 and 205 width on the 15s, another comparison there too lol.

 

[hodgy21]

I've just put the new style of top mount on mine and it has completely got rid of the full lock judder.

I have also fitted Yokohama AD08's and can say that they are better than the PE2's (imo), I have a feeling that they will not last as long though.

 

[Gordon]

They are 195/50s mate.

Any reason why you went for the 195 over the 205 as both are available in XXX/50 R15?

I presume the T's standard Turini is 16"x7 so the 7" width would cope with the 205 without a problem and keep the OEM tyre footprint. As you say, it would be another interesting test.

I've read that 172 Cup's came with a 16" Turini and 195/45 R16 rubber as OEM. Then 182's were 'beefed up' to 205/45 R16 as standard. Perhaps to 'cope' with the extra few bhp; but I don't see the few bhp being a problem. Perhaps the 205 width was used to help with a handling upgrade if the 182's track was widened or the wheel offset changed.

Using the rolling circumference calculator the speedometer will be out by approximately -2.5kph at 56mph with the 195/50 R15's and only -0.8kph at 56mph using 205/50 R15's (using the 205/45 R16's as the reference tyre). The tyre comfort value also increases from 4.1 to 4.9 between the 195 and 205 on the 15's, whereas comfort value with the R16's is 3.1.

The rolling circumference is a difference of 14mm using the 205/50 R15's over the 205/45 16's. Static rolling radius is 5mm difference. This seems a significant reduction from the 45mm difference in rolling circumference between the 195/50 R15's and 205/45 R16's.

Just looking at the numbers the 205/50 R15's would seem to offer almost no variance in speedometer reading, a little softer ride (due to the higher sidewall and 4.9 comfort value vs 3.1 on OEM 16's. Comfort value seems a bit vague, but there is an additional volume of 0.75 litres of air in the 205 vs the 195, so theoretically more air, more comfort) and possibly a similar level of lateral grip as they have the same 205 footprint as OEM.

Going to be all in the driving of course. If it were me I might go for the 205/50 R15 if I was shifting to 15"x7 wheels.

Although the 195/50 R15's are £50.10 inc VAT and 205/50 R15's £95.60 inc VAT! Nearly a whole tyre more expensive...

 

[Gordon]

I have also fitted Yokohama AD08's and can say that they are better than the PE2's (imo), I have a feeling that they will not last as long though.

Have you been out in the wet yet though? I hear Yokohama's are super in the dry, but turn into bars of soap in the rain.

 

[Marl]

Hodgy21, what type of topmount have you gone for and do you have any other suspension mod's like mark fish springs.?
cheers Marl

 

[Will#I#Ams]

Was more to do with cost tbh mate. For the 205s I might as well have stuck with the 16s, not sure the turn in would have been as direct, but like I say that would be another comparison to test lol. Going from other people's opinions, most use the 195 s when dropping down to 15s also. But then the cost of tyres for 195s make for a cheaper option when it comes to trackdays also. Bit of swings and roundabouts really. Like I said tho, I'm happier with how the car handles now than I was before, but that's all down to personal preference. 1 man's dirt is another's gold etc.

 

[hodgy21]

I have been out in the wet, but I never push it because I know that they do not disperse as much water as a more road orientated tyre, and thus would have less grip.

I try to drive for the conditions and keep within my skill level if you know what I mean. Pushing my car in the wet seems like a bad idea to me, I don't want to slide off into a ditch somewhere because I have the wrong tyres for the situation.

The reason I put the AD08's on was because I wanted that crisp turn in that the PE2's had, which I lost with the PS3's. The AD08's give me that turn in response and more grip as well. As I have not really tried to push the car in the wet I can't really comment on that side of the performance, but I would imagine they are not quite as good as the PE2/PS3 but I am only guessing.

Marl, I was chatting to Danny @ 519 automotive and I mentioned the low speed full lock judder and he said that Renault had released a new design of top mount for the Clio, so I figured I'd give them a go. The basic deign change is that they have combined the top hat bush and the nyloc nut into one component. When they were separate parts they could move independently and make the noise. Now that they have been combined there is no movement.

It cured it for me so I'm over the moon. I Think they were £45 each.