Un pinning dampers and top bearings

[shiftspark]

Hi fella's

I know this has been covered many times but does anyone have any clear pictures of the thumb wheel preferably with it removed if not any close ups would be good.

Also the strut top mount bearings, how much if any play should there be in them as the ones on mine look like they have come off a child's toy! with loads of side and up/down movement?

Cheers

 

[hoolio]

The bearing in the top mounts is a joke isn't it, i've got an exploded pic if you want it and i can take some pics of the wheel on my spares if you want.

 

[hoolio]

The big fat rubber bit that sits inside the turret moves around quite a lot though i don't recall it moving up and down.

 

[BenG]

Also the strut top mount bearings, how much if any play should there be in them as the ones on mine look like they have come off a child's toy! with loads of side and up/down movement?

Mine was/is the same. Once the weight of the car is on them there is obviously no movement but i figured thats what makes the clunking noise on bumpy road surfaces. There Sh**e !

 

[shiftspark]

The bearing in the top mounts is a joke isn't it, i've got an exploded pic if you want it and i can take some pics of the wheel on my spares if you want.

The so called bearing has loads of play so much so it's hardly a bearing! How much are they as I may put new ones on when I refit the struts.
Hoolio the rubber mounts are very loose when fitted to the struts these must move around I would of thought under heavy load hence the improvement solid top mounts offer.
Mark fish said that they also cut down torque steer aswell but can make the car feel a bit nervous under braking.
What do you and BenG think about yours as I may try some?

 

[shiftspark]

Any pics of the adjuster thumb wheel anyone?

 

[hoolio]

Any pics of the adjuster thumb wheel anyone?

Why? they are all the same I can email you some later if you wish.

As to the bearing, shall we just call it the "big washer" from now on I can see why MF thought STM's might cut down on torque steer with the ammount of movement though if everything is inline/balanced etc i can't see why they should cause any more twitchyness(?) they've always been a little light and i can't say that it has got got any worse, like I've said before it feels a whole lot better now.

 

[BenG]

I removed my STM's because they were way too harsh for road use and I was not happy with the quality of them (KTR/Compbrake ones). They drove me mad, They did what they said on the tin but the cons outweighed the pros, but thats just my opinion, others may disagree, bearing in mind I drive mostly B roads which are harsh anyways.

The Mark Fish STM's are what I would buy if I was to invest in another set. Apparently you can gain back most of the ride comfort if you set the dampers to a softer setting, but thats just going backwards...

When you say adjuster thumb wheel do you mean the dial to adjust the damping ?

I would go take some pics of mine but its easier for the damper tech guy (hoolio) to do it with his spares.

 

[BenG]

Pic of Dial.

 

[Ajr]

Have you played with your settings ben?

I drive the most awful roads in the UK on a daily basis and also the guy at BG said he thought the settings were very hard for road use.

I'm probably going to have a play soon, a few clicks softer should increase front end grip by a measurable amount!

 

[BenG]

Ive not had much of a play since I had them serviced, Ive been waiting for summer to arrive when the roads are dry.

I think 22 clicks is a good compromise between A and B roads, but yeah, my theory is that a softer seting will be better for B roads too. the front end should 'dig in' more but this in turn will increase the roll ? I also think a softer setting will make the car less skittish over the rough stuff (B roads) ?

 

[shiftspark]

Cheers for the picture but I will have to drill the grub screws out and wanted to see underneath the adjuster to see what I am drilling into.
Luckily the pins are well away from the grub screws so its just a matter of drilling them out and fitting new grub screws.

Hoolio could you pm a pic if its convenient?

Cheers

 

[Ossie87]

there's definitely a topic on unpinning the dampers, I've seen it before but I can't find it! anyone know where it is?

 

[hoolio]

Pm sent.
There is a thread, it may even be a sticky but depending what shiftspark wants ill probably do a with pics guide.

 

[Ajr]

I would recommend replacing the adjusters and seals if unpinning.

Ben, i doubt it would allow a noticeable amount more body roll, the springs & anti roll bars control the weight transfer mainly, the dampers are just there to control the springs. The gas pressure in the dampers does add to the effective spring rate although that's not adjusted it'll just be compression and rebound rates that are adjusted. I think they are slightly overdamped as standard, certainly for rough roads. The clio should stay a bit more composed over rough roads with the damping turned down a few clicks, with an overall increase in front end grip. This might unbalance it a bit though making the back end more mobile than it already is.

But i am yet to play as i simply don't have time! And was wondering if anyone else had tried it.

 

[BenG]

Agreed, I think dialing them down anymore than 4-5 clicks will reduce turn in response and cause a slight unbalance. But, I think you could afford to dial them down slightly to improve the front end grip without compromise.
Ill put it to the test...

 

[shiftspark]

Well finally got them both un pinned.
One of them was relatively easy as I just drilled the grub screw out, praised the wheel off, re tapped the thread and knocked the pin up untill it cleared the dimples in the underside of the wheel.

The other was a nightmare as I foolishly snapped an allan key in it whilst trying to undo it,this then made drilling the grub screw and allan key difficult to say the least!Managed to do it eventually by drilling them out with a larger drill tip made for drilling stainless steel, then had to drill a new hole to fit the grub screw.

Motto of this dont use cheap allan keys as these snap easily especially as those that have not been un pinned will be very difficult to just unscrew.Also everyone seems to suggest that a 2mm allan key fits but I found that a 2mm was just on the small side and 2.5mm doesnt fit and they are not imperial.
You would also benifit from using a pedestal drill and vice rather than a hand drill on the floor.
Also the pins are hardened steel so drilling them would be very difficult without specialist drills.

Now just need some time to have a try with different settings

Also trying to get some replacement adjusters is probably a good idea before you try as this will stop the sweaty palms as you drill into the grub screws :lol:

 

[hoolio]

Adjusters ae not available on there own only as part of the top assembly as per my pm to you. Ben at BG said it added about 25 a side to the price of a refurb;

 

[480bhp.com]

Has anyone got a picture of the damper with the adjuster removed?

A few weeks back i took the dampers of the car as i intended fitting the adjustable top mounts, but it turned out they had supplied the wrong spacer, i took the 1st damper off the car, it was fine and unmolestered, this is when i toyed with the idea of unpining them, but decided i'd leave it for another day so i just cleaned the damper and spring and refitted, seeing as i'd done the nearside i thought i may as well remove and clean up the offside, that's when i discovered a previous owner had got jiggy with his black and decker drill set. For some reason he had drilled a 5/6mm hole in the top of the adjuster and then another at the side of that but the 2nd hole was not all the way through :?
I've no idea what he was trying to acheive :?
Seeing as i've been around the intimate parts of cars for many years i decided that it would be best left alone until after the Donington trackday just incase he had done some damage beyond what was visible.

So back to my question has anyone got a picture of the damper with the adjuster removed, that way i can see what possible damage could have been done :x

Chris

 

[Cue]

the hole in the top is where the pin would have been - it sounds like he's drilled the grub screw out and removed the pin - which will probably have let dirt and grit into the dial mechanism, buggering up the ball bearing and making adjusting the damper very difficult.