Lightness Revisited - A 172 Cup Adventure.
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Alignment Adventure. Part 1.
May 2026.
I've been wanting to get the Cup over to Chong at Atec Align for a little while now and finally this week, managed to get the car booked in for an initial session. The Cup has felt pretty good chassis-wise, both on the road and on the hill, but clattering a pot hole on the way back from the last meeting had me thinking I really ought to look at the numbers to make sure it's ok and see if any tweaks could be done.
The car has always driven with the hint that there's a fair bit of toe-out on the front end, something which I quite like, but on track just feels like it needs some extra negative camber. The car tracks straight and true beautifully and does currently feel pretty confidence inspiring but I know there's a smidgen more grip to eke out of it yet, even before sticky tyres are added.
The mornings work activities completed, I whizzed over to the unit and rolled the Cup out into a changeable day of weather, one minute warm and sunny, the next pelting it down. As I joined the local motorway, I couldn't help but roll my eyes as we were caught yet again in more torrential rain. I'd left myself with what I thought to be plenty of time for our trip over the Pennines, but the congestion on the M62 had other ideas. I've mentioned previously that the Cup hates any sort of slow moving stop-start traffic, so after a few miles of this on the motorway I decided to dive off and take an old route which I used to love back in the day when I had my 1st 172 Cup new.
The A640 out of Denshaw over to Huddersfield is an excellent ribbon of tarmac, or at least it used to be.. Now hampered by new lower limits for much of the interesting stuff, I find myself frustrated in the Cup. It wants to run a bit on a road like this, but at the new limits it feels completely hamstrung, it's hard to get a car like this to flow and feel settled at such a reined-in pace, it doesn't do justice to the car or the road, and the whole experience just feels stiff, disjointed and stifled. The last time I came along this road was a couple of years back in the 60 odd year old Mini and had an absolute hoot of a time, I seem to recall it was still all NSL back then and the old 998 just romped along, as I crawl along in the Cup I can't help but despair slightly at the state of things these days.
It takes at least 1/2 an hour longer than it should to get to Chong's but I arrive in time for the appointment at least. We pop the Cup up on the ramp and take some measurements, it's all looking reasonably decent, it could do with more camber on the front, but what really impresses is how close all the settings are side to side and how straight the rear beam set-up is. So, base numbers sorted, it's now up to me to get the plan in place for the next phase. Having a close look at things with Chong, it's going to make sense to refresh some of the hardware and the track rods. As a track orientated car, everything needs to be a little bit newer and more easily adjustable underneath. What I do have now though is a great starting point from which to fine tune it and get it all dialled in. I had hoped that I might be further on with this by now, but we've had a lot on lately. I trundle back over the Pennines, working out which parts I'm going to need, what I've got 'in-stock' and what I'll need to source, my self imposed season budget is looking evermore inadequate...
In a couple of days I'm booked on to the Academy Day at Harewood, so I'm hoping what I'm currently lacking in final chassis fine tuning I can offset by gaining more track time, knowledge and practice. A day to look forward to, I just hope the rain holds off, at least for the 'track walk' part, there's nothing worse than damp race pumps.
May 2026.
I've been wanting to get the Cup over to Chong at Atec Align for a little while now and finally this week, managed to get the car booked in for an initial session. The Cup has felt pretty good chassis-wise, both on the road and on the hill, but clattering a pot hole on the way back from the last meeting had me thinking I really ought to look at the numbers to make sure it's ok and see if any tweaks could be done.
The car has always driven with the hint that there's a fair bit of toe-out on the front end, something which I quite like, but on track just feels like it needs some extra negative camber. The car tracks straight and true beautifully and does currently feel pretty confidence inspiring but I know there's a smidgen more grip to eke out of it yet, even before sticky tyres are added.
The mornings work activities completed, I whizzed over to the unit and rolled the Cup out into a changeable day of weather, one minute warm and sunny, the next pelting it down. As I joined the local motorway, I couldn't help but roll my eyes as we were caught yet again in more torrential rain. I'd left myself with what I thought to be plenty of time for our trip over the Pennines, but the congestion on the M62 had other ideas. I've mentioned previously that the Cup hates any sort of slow moving stop-start traffic, so after a few miles of this on the motorway I decided to dive off and take an old route which I used to love back in the day when I had my 1st 172 Cup new.
The A640 out of Denshaw over to Huddersfield is an excellent ribbon of tarmac, or at least it used to be.. Now hampered by new lower limits for much of the interesting stuff, I find myself frustrated in the Cup. It wants to run a bit on a road like this, but at the new limits it feels completely hamstrung, it's hard to get a car like this to flow and feel settled at such a reined-in pace, it doesn't do justice to the car or the road, and the whole experience just feels stiff, disjointed and stifled. The last time I came along this road was a couple of years back in the 60 odd year old Mini and had an absolute hoot of a time, I seem to recall it was still all NSL back then and the old 998 just romped along, as I crawl along in the Cup I can't help but despair slightly at the state of things these days.
It takes at least 1/2 an hour longer than it should to get to Chong's but I arrive in time for the appointment at least. We pop the Cup up on the ramp and take some measurements, it's all looking reasonably decent, it could do with more camber on the front, but what really impresses is how close all the settings are side to side and how straight the rear beam set-up is. So, base numbers sorted, it's now up to me to get the plan in place for the next phase. Having a close look at things with Chong, it's going to make sense to refresh some of the hardware and the track rods. As a track orientated car, everything needs to be a little bit newer and more easily adjustable underneath. What I do have now though is a great starting point from which to fine tune it and get it all dialled in. I had hoped that I might be further on with this by now, but we've had a lot on lately. I trundle back over the Pennines, working out which parts I'm going to need, what I've got 'in-stock' and what I'll need to source, my self imposed season budget is looking evermore inadequate...
In a couple of days I'm booked on to the Academy Day at Harewood, so I'm hoping what I'm currently lacking in final chassis fine tuning I can offset by gaining more track time, knowledge and practice. A day to look forward to, I just hope the rain holds off, at least for the 'track walk' part, there's nothing worse than damp race pumps.
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Taking a bit of curb.. (Photo credit: Chris Bannister @ JCB Photography).
The approach to Orchard, Harewood Open Hillclimb, May 2026.
hoolio
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So I guess you will be leaving the rear settings as factory? What about the fronts? I always thought mine was toe out but going through the posts on here from years ago I might have toe in. (something I will need to be making a decision on soon)
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Yes, I'll be leaving the rear well alone for now Jules, it's running a matching set of camber and toe, as close to perfect as I think you'd find really, which is pretty amazing for a 24 year old car! Both Chong and myself were pretty shocked to be honest!
The front, I'll be running a fair bit of toe out (slightly more than I do on a pure road car such as the Trophy) and dialling in as much camber as the bolts will give me, approx 1.75 degrees.
Are you sure you're reading your alignment print outs correctly, toe out is recorded conversely as a minus figure on the front axle. Avoid any sort of toe-in on the front end Jules. Someone once mistakenly set up my Trophy the wrong way round on the readings - toeing it in instead of out and it handled like a complete dog, almost undriveable and verging on dangerous! I'd recommend 7minutes per side, so 14minutes toe-out total on a Trophy is a sweet spot for the road.
hoolio
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Yes I think I must have been mistaken when I posted that back then. There was no readout, Mark Fish Performed the adjustment with bits of string and sticks (and about a million years of experience) so I never had anything to refer back to. After I had the toe dialled in it felt far more settled so I suspect toe out was dialled in and pretty sure it was ten minutes though not certain if it was in total or on each side i‘m slightly embarrassed to admit.
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I'm currently on 12minutes per side on the Cup, it's too much for the road really but feels very planted and turns in an absolute treat on the hill.
