Trophy review in Car magazine.

[mr StinKa gob]

'Its the closest we've got to a modern 205 gti - in other words the closest to perfection today'

Thats one of the farest comments ive read in a review.

I think the reviewer basically thought the Trophy was good as it was trying to echo the past. A point which seems to fall on deaf ears for some people. From what ive read / seen / heard, i dont think the Trophy is good because its a step forward. The Trophy seems to be good because its a STEP BACK. Trying to recreate the old school. Which lets face it, had the best hot hatch cars.

Golf GTI
Clio Williams
Pug 205
5 Turbo

 

[OliS]

The Trophy is a step forward, it is a step forward from the 182 cup

I believe the Clio 172/182 has been so popular because they embody what a hot hatch should be, quick, nimble and aggresive. This has been Renault's formula for hot hatches for the past 20 years it is not an attempt to recreate the old school, just an attempt to create a great car!

Hyb, just worked out that I only have a black and white scanner at work #-o Maybe someone else has the Autocar with the Trophy in and access to a colour scanner. Will post the links the the internet reviews this evening when I get home.

 

[hyb]

Ok Oli, do you know what is on the cover of that autocar ? I swear I had them all!

 

[OliS]

There are three Autocar's with the Trophy in it, one is the initial drive of the Trophy and there is a picture of the Trophy on 3 wheels on the cover, the second (which I don't have) IIRC was a handling guide using the Trophy to demonstrate certain handling techniques, and the third was the best drivers cars of the year which has about 10 of the best cars of the year on the cover. Will post the issue numbers and dates later

 

[mr StinKa gob]

The Trophy is a step forward, it is a step forward from the 182 cup

I believe the Clio 172/182 has been so popular because they embody what a hot hatch should be, quick, nimble and aggresive. This has been Renault's formula for hot hatches for the past 20 years it is not an attempt to recreate the old school, just an attempt to create a great car!

They are pupular because they are cheap. How many 182 owners wouldnt swap for a Focus RS if they were the same price? Most people who buy a 182 do so because they cant afford a CTR.

If an ITR was 12 k would you still have bought the trophy?

 

[OliS]

Definately, because the ITR is an import only and the insurance is too steep. I agree with you that they are cheap, but surely that is a good thing that you can get such performance for so little money!?! Anyway if they were cheap but crap they would not have sold in such massive numbers.

If the ITR was a uk spec car availble for £12k new, it would be a dilema, but it isn't, and if Honda was to produce the ITR for £12k it would not be the same car that it is now!

Additionally, I love Renault hot hatches, the Trophy is my third in a row, and I even persuaded the missus to buy one, they handle differently to Jap cars, and in my experience are better suited for British roads.

On a different note, does it hurt that when the Trophy is compared to the greatest hot hatch ever, people compare it to the 205 gti rather than the Williams?

 

[Nik]

They are pupular because they are cheap.
Yep value for money is a factor for me, as Clarkson said, 'It's impossible to go quicker for less'. But there are a lot of people who could afford much more expensive cars driving 172/182's though, so its not just because they are cheap, thats just a bonus

How many 182 owners wouldnt swap for a Focus RS if they were the same price?
I wouldnt swap the Trophy for a Focus RS.

Most people who buy a 182 do so because they cant afford a CTR.
I don't think thats the case for MOST people at all. Anyone i hear of who's test driven both have chosen the 182.

If an ITR was 12 k would you still have bought the trophy?
No, I'd probably have an ITR sat on the driveway :lol:

 

[hyb]

I've had an s2000 and a wrx, both faster and much more expensive then the trophy, I don't think that plays a factor at all, I think the trophy is incredible value for what your getting. I looked at the CTR and the 182 before even thinking about the trophy, for me I just didn't like it, you were spending 95% of the money for the engine and gearbox, the rest of the car had no personality, I would have taken the 182 over the ctr from a back to back comparison.

 

[mr StinKa gob]

Definately, because the ITR is an import only and the insurance is too steep. I agree with you that they are cheap, but surely that is a good thing that you can get such performance for so little money!?! Anyway if they were cheap but crap they would not have sold in such massive numbers.

If the ITR was a uk spec car availble for £12k new, it would be a dilema, but it isn't, and if Honda was to produce the ITR for £12k it would not be the same car that it is now!

Additionally, I love Renault hot hatches, the Trophy is my third in a row, and I even persuaded the missus to buy one, they handle differently to Jap cars, and in my experience are better suited for British roads.

On a different note, does it hurt that when the Trophy is compared to the greatest hot hatch ever, people compare it to the 205 gti rather than the Williams?

Did i say the car was crap? I said it was popular because its cheap. Simple economics. Cheap things sell in higher volumes. Thats why they are cheap. :roll:

I agree the 205 gti is a pretender for the best driver hot hatch of all time. Its a different car to the Williams. The 205 is very knife edge in its characteristics, wheras the Williams is very sure footed. So it depends what you want from a car. There is no doubt the Williams is quicker cross country.

The reason i like my Williams is because spotty little shits will never be able to afford to buy one and keep it in the condition i keep mine. It takes alot of effort and money to maintain them. So its exlusive.

Any old scrote can go and buy a Trophy or a 182 or a ctr on finance and do their traffic light races and go on and on about the reviews it gets. No one can ever own a better clio williams than mine, as its the first UK one off the production line. I could however go out tomorrow and buy a mint 205, as there are still lots about.

I dont buy these cars to drive quickly, i buy them as i like restoring cars and i like rare things. If i wanted a fast car id go and buy a P1, then when i met a trophy, the driver may start to comprehend what a proper car can do.

Buying a trophy to go fast seems a bit of a waste of cash to me personally.

So i dont care no.

 

[OliS]

I did not say that you said the car was crap, I was just making a point :roll: Crap things will stop selling even if they are cheap...the Clio keeps on selling because it is cheap, but is is good! Simple economics :wink:

I bought my Trophy because it is rare and it will only get rarer, not just to go fast.

 

[Lee]

Definately, because the ITR is an import only and the insurance is too steep. I agree with you that they are cheap, but surely that is a good thing that you can get such performance for so little money!?! Anyway if they were cheap but crap they would not have sold in such massive numbers.

If the ITR was a uk spec car availble for £12k new, it would be a dilema, but it isn't, and if Honda was to produce the ITR for £12k it would not be the same car that it is now!

Additionally, I love Renault hot hatches, the Trophy is my third in a row, and I even persuaded the missus to buy one, they handle differently to Jap cars, and in my experience are better suited for British roads.

On a different note, does it hurt that when the Trophy is compared to the greatest hot hatch ever, people compare it to the 205 gti rather than the Williams?

Did i say the car was crap? I said it was popular because its cheap. Simple economics. Cheap things sell in higher volumes. Thats why they are cheap. :roll:

I agree the 205 gti is a pretender for the best driver hot hatch of all time. Its a different car to the Williams. The 205 is very knife edge in its characteristics, wheras the Williams is very sure footed. So it depends what you want from a car. There is no doubt the Williams is quicker cross country.

The reason i like my Williams is because spotty little shits will never be able to afford to buy one and keep it in the condition i keep mine. It takes alot of effort and money to maintain them. So its exlusive.

Any old scrote can go and buy a Trophy or a 182 or a ctr on finance and do their traffic light races and go on and on about the reviews it gets. No one can ever own a better clio williams than mine, as its the first UK one off the production line. I could however go out tomorrow and buy a mint 205, as there are still lots about.

I dont buy these cars to drive quickly, i buy them as i like restoring cars and i like rare things. If i wanted a fast car id go and buy a P1, then when i met a trophy, the driver may start to comprehend what a proper car can do.

Buying a trophy to go fast seems a bit of a waste of cash to me personally.

So i dont care no.

That's interesting logic. :?

With that thinking anyone can buy a beat up old Williams and restore it to better condition than 0002 with £15k.

 

[Tomx]

I thought Williams number 1 was coming up for sale, some Spotty little shit could buy that for less than a Trophy. Face it a Williams is never going to be worth thousands and whats exclusive about them when you can get one for a grand, yours maybe more shiney but its still the same car.

 

[hyb]

nice new car or old relic that no one really thinks 'wow what an amaaazing car' contrary to a few peoples beliefs

 

[mr StinKa gob]

I did not say that you said the car was crap, I was just making a point :roll: Crap things will stop selling even if they are cheap...the Clio keeps on selling because it is cheap, but is is good! Simple economics :wink:

I bought my Trophy because it is rare and it will only get rarer, not just to go fast.

But its not rare. There are thousands of mk2 2litre cars.

 

[mr StinKa gob]

I thought Williams number 1 was coming up for sale, some Spotty little shit could buy that for less than a Trophy. Face it a Williams is never going to be worth thousands and whats exclusive about them when you can get one for a grand, yours maybe more shiney but its still the same car.

Forstly 0001 is not a UK car. Its lhd.

Secondly, it will go for over 30 grand. So no, spotty little gimps wont be able to afford it.

Thirdly. You say a williams will never be worth thousands in one sentence, then in the next say you can get one for a grand, which by definition is thousands. So how can we trust anything you say when you cant even string an argument together. :roll:

 

[mr StinKa gob]

nice new car or old relic that no one really thinks 'wow what an amaaazing car' contrary to a few peoples beliefs

In the same way an cosworth, Delta integrale or F355 is a relic. Im happy to be associated with those kinds of relics in an age related way. It was a classic age, full of cars that are too hard for the playstation generation to drive.

(oooohh, i need traction control mummy, and abs please and my coordination levels means i have difficulty brushing my teeth let alone controling a proper car.)

More so that id want to be associated with the 'new' mini, the pug 206 gti and the Xara picasso. Hmm all new, and all shit. Enjoy the party with your new friends turkey

 

[Lee]

Any old scrote can go and buy a Trophy or a 182 or a ctr on finance and do their traffic light races and go on and on about the reviews it gets. No one can ever own a better clio williams than mine, as its the first UK one off the production line. I could however go out tomorrow and buy a mint 205, as there are still lots about.

That's incorrect, 0001 was before 0002, can you not count? Just because 0001 isn't around anymore it doesn't change the fact that it came off the line before 0002.

 

[mr StinKa gob]

Definately, because the ITR is an import only and the insurance is too steep. I agree with you that they are cheap, but surely that is a good thing that you can get such performance for so little money!?! Anyway if they were cheap but crap they would not have sold in such massive numbers.

If the ITR was a uk spec car availble for £12k new, it would be a dilema, but it isn't, and if Honda was to produce the ITR for £12k it would not be the same car that it is now!

Additionally, I love Renault hot hatches, the Trophy is my third in a row, and I even persuaded the missus to buy one, they handle differently to Jap cars, and in my experience are better suited for British roads.

On a different note, does it hurt that when the Trophy is compared to the greatest hot hatch ever, people compare it to the 205 gti rather than the Williams?

Did i say the car was crap? I said it was popular because its cheap. Simple economics. Cheap things sell in higher volumes. Thats why they are cheap. :roll:

I agree the 205 gti is a pretender for the best driver hot hatch of all time. Its a different car to the Williams. The 205 is very knife edge in its characteristics, wheras the Williams is very sure footed. So it depends what you want from a car. There is no doubt the Williams is quicker cross country.

The reason i like my Williams is because spotty little shits will never be able to afford to buy one and keep it in the condition i keep mine. It takes alot of effort and money to maintain them. So its exlusive.

Any old scrote can go and buy a Trophy or a 182 or a ctr on finance and do their traffic light races and go on and on about the reviews it gets. No one can ever own a better clio williams than mine, as its the first UK one off the production line. I could however go out tomorrow and buy a mint 205, as there are still lots about.

I dont buy these cars to drive quickly, i buy them as i like restoring cars and i like rare things. If i wanted a fast car id go and buy a P1, then when i met a trophy, the driver may start to comprehend what a proper car can do.

Buying a trophy to go fast seems a bit of a waste of cash to me personally.

So i dont care no.

That's interesting logic. :?

With that thinking anyone can buy a beat up old Williams and restore it to better condition than 0002 with £15k.

Yeah of course they could. But people dont, so my car remaind exclusive.

 

[mr StinKa gob]

Any old scrote can go and buy a Trophy or a 182 or a ctr on finance and do their traffic light races and go on and on about the reviews it gets. No one can ever own a better clio williams than mine, as its the first UK one off the production line. I could however go out tomorrow and buy a mint 205, as there are still lots about.

That's incorrect, 0001 was before 0002, can you not count? Just because 0001 isn't around anymore it doesn't change the fact that it came off the line before 0002.

Bit of advice, dont argue with me about the history of the Williams, as you will lose. 0001 is ldh. Hence its NOT a UK car. Hence when i said first UK car to come off the production line, i was in effect right, and when you argued with me, you were technically pretty wrong.

Have a nice day.

 

[Lee]

[quote="King Stromba":suoijgle]

Definately, because the ITR is an import only and the insurance is too steep. I agree with you that they are cheap, but surely that is a good thing that you can get such performance for so little money!?! Anyway if they were cheap but crap they would not have sold in such massive numbers.

If the ITR was a uk spec car availble for £12k new, it would be a dilema, but it isn't, and if Honda was to produce the ITR for £12k it would not be the same car that it is now!

Additionally, I love Renault hot hatches, the Trophy is my third in a row, and I even persuaded the missus to buy one, they handle differently to Jap cars, and in my experience are better suited for British roads.

On a different note, does it hurt that when the Trophy is compared to the greatest hot hatch ever, people compare it to the 205 gti rather than the Williams?

Did i say the car was crap? I said it was popular because its cheap. Simple economics. Cheap things sell in higher volumes. Thats why they are cheap. :roll:

I agree the 205 gti is a pretender for the best driver hot hatch of all time. Its a different car to the Williams. The 205 is very knife edge in its characteristics, wheras the Williams is very sure footed. So it depends what you want from a car. There is no doubt the Williams is quicker cross country.

The reason i like my Williams is because spotty little shits will never be able to afford to buy one and keep it in the condition i keep mine. It takes alot of effort and money to maintain them. So its exlusive.

Any old scrote can go and buy a Trophy or a 182 or a ctr on finance and do their traffic light races and go on and on about the reviews it gets. No one can ever own a better clio williams than mine, as its the first UK one off the production line. I could however go out tomorrow and buy a mint 205, as there are still lots about.

I dont buy these cars to drive quickly, i buy them as i like restoring cars and i like rare things. If i wanted a fast car id go and buy a P1, then when i met a trophy, the driver may start to comprehend what a proper car can do.

Buying a trophy to go fast seems a bit of a waste of cash to me personally.

So i dont care no.

That's interesting logic. :?

With that thinking anyone can buy a beat up old Williams and restore it to better condition than 0002 with £15k.

Yeah of course they could. But people dont, so my car remaind exclusive.[/quote:suoijgle]



Do you think that could because a car of that age becomes something of a money pit where only the very dedicated are prepared to put the time, money and effort into maintaining it?