de cat - what to expect?

[son of solo]

seeing as i wont have to MOT my trophy for another 2 years i was thinkibg about a possible de-cat
what can i expect to gain from this? power and torque wise?
would i have to inform the insurance company?
cheers

 

[MickD]

I'm sure that someone will correct me if i'm wrong, but I thought that a cat was a legal requirement for road use for any car built after a certain date (I think it was 1992 or thereabouts)?

Which means that if you tell your insurance company they will refuse to insure you because your car won't be road legal.

On the other hand if you don't tell them, do remove the cat and the car thus isn't road legal then your insurance cover will be invalid anyway, and you will be technically driving without insurance.

I'm not trying to be a killjoy, I know that a lot of people do remove the cat and get away with it, but if they are involved in an accident and make a claim then the insurance company will surely just say "your car wasn't legal at the time of the accident and so your cover was invalid". You could possibly even get prosecuted for driving without insurance.

I know that you don't have to get an MOT for a couple of years but you are still required to have a road legal car. If you need to claim on your insurance you could open a huge can of worms, unless you have the chance to re-fit the cat before the insurance Gestapo can inspect the car.

Why not get a sports cat instead which is less restrictive but still legal.

If, on the other hand, I'm wrong and a cat is not a legal requirement then all of the above is bulls**t and you can just ignore it. :lol:

 

[oliie]

I agree MickD.

The thought of a 2bhp gain vs driving an uninsured car is a bit of a no-brainer. Especially when there are people being paid by insurance companies to find something on your now crashed car that would invalidate the insurance policy.

Cheers
O.

 

[mindgam3]

I know many ferrari and exotica owners decat their cars.

Are you sure its a completely legal requirement?

I thought it was legal if it still passes the MOT emmisions test and is not excessively loud?

 

[corneyman]

I think Ollie and MickD are right, a car needs a cat to be road legal. I put a decat on mine but I've now gone for a Sports cat instead. The emmissions are legal again and I haven't noticed any real difference in performance. I got it as part of a new exhaust from Charlie at Prospeed which could be something to do with that, though.

 

[oliie]

I know many ferrari and exotica owners decat their cars.

Are you sure its a completely legal requirement?

I thought it was legal if it still passes the MOT emmisions test and is not excessively loud?

You will not pass emmissionts tests with a decat (that is it's sole purpose).

I agree re your point Ferrari's etc. but it does not mean they will have a claim paid out. Plus it is likely they can take the brunt of any costs...

O.

 

[MickD]

I know many ferrari and exotica owners decat their cars.

Are you sure its a completely legal requirement?

I thought it was legal if it still passes the MOT emmisions test and is not excessively loud?

As Oliie said, how is the car going to pass an emmissions test without a cat?

It doesn't matter whether the car is a Ferrari or a knackered old Ford Fiesta, if it cannot pass an emmissions test then it's not legal, and therefore not covered by insurance.

I know that many people de-cat their cars and drive them on the road without anyone knowing, but if the day comes that they have an accident their insurance company will say that their cover is invalid because the car is not road legal. This means that they could be prosecuted for driving without insurance. It also means that every penny that they have paid in premiums has been a total waste of money. As I said before, the only hope is that the cars owner can re-fit the cat before the insurance Gestapo or the police can get a look at it.

Is it worth the risk?

Why not ring your insurance company and ask them if they will cover a car that has had the cat removed? That will give you your answer.

(P.S. I remember reading on another forum about a bloke with a four year old car who thought that he could get around all of this by taking off his cat, smashing the insides out with a hammer and a long brick chisel and then re-fitting the empty shell. He was very proud of himself until someone pointed out that he would have to go out and buy a brand new cat to get it through the emmissions test on MOT day)

 

[bakedbeats]

I don’t think the fitting of a decat automatically voids your insurance just because the car is no longer road legal.

I would suggest that your car will remain road legal until it gets tested and fails, when you are likely to be given a certain amount of time to put it right. Until a test result is obtained no-one will be able to say whether or not the emissions break the law (n.b. I fitted a decat to my Trophy and the emissions light hasn't come up). Even if this is not the case, I don’t see why your insurance policy should become automatically void unless there is a term in your policy that requires you to keep the vehicle road legal.

I know of certain specialist sports car manufacturers who get their cars approved with a cat on (to pass the emissions test) then remove it before sale to customers for use on the road. I doubt that the insurance co. could argue that the policy is invalid in these circs just because it doesn't have a cat.

For the reasons above, I believe that any insurance issue is likely to be focused on you not having told them about the modification rather than on the car not being road legal. In which case, I think there would be a good argument for why you should be insured so long as the decat has no way contributed to the cause of the damage/accident.

Check the terms of your policy to see what it says about informing them of mods. and keeping the car in a roadworthy condition etc.

 

[Steve]

What insurance company is going to insure a non-road legal car(i.e. one without a catalytic converter - a legal requirement) for use on the road?

By informing the insurance company of the removal of the cat, they would be unable to insure you. If anyone doubts this, phone your broker and see what they say...

 

[7MAT]

I've been reading this thread with great interest as only four days ago I removed my sports cat and fitted a de-cat.

After a google search I found the UK MOT Test Magazine website, which states the following;

6. Your vehicle has had its catalytic converter removed and replaced by a normal exhaust silencer but passes the emissions Test. Does it fail the MOT because it hasn't got a catalytic converter when it should have one?

a) No, if it passes the emissions part of the MOT that is acceptable.

So if your car can be MOT legal without a CAT, then it stands to reason that it can't be an insurance failure.

http://www.motester.co.uk
http://www.motester.co.uk/motquizans.html

 

[Neal]

I've been reading this thread with great interest as only four days ago I removed my sports cat and fitted a de-cat.

After a google search I found the UK MOT Test Magazine website, which states the following;

6. Your vehicle has had its catalytic converter removed and replaced by a normal exhaust silencer but passes the emissions Test. Does it fail the MOT because it hasn't got a catalytic converter when it should have one?

a) No, if it passes the emissions part of the MOT that is acceptable.

So if your car can be MOT legal without a CAT, then it stands to reason that it can't be an insurance failure.

Get a emissions test dun on your car if it has a de-cat pipe on it. It will not pass I've lost count of the amount of cat i have replace throw car failing there emissions test but that will not stop me from putting one on

 

[Neal]

I've been reading this thread with great interest as only four days ago I removed my sports cat and fitted a de-cat.

After a google search I found the UK MOT Test Magazine website, which states the following;

6. Your vehicle has had its catalytic converter removed and replaced by a normal exhaust silencer but passes the emissions Test. Does it fail the MOT because it hasn't got a catalytic converter when it should have one?

a) No, if it passes the emissions part of the MOT that is acceptable.

So if your car can be MOT legal without a CAT, then it stands to reason that it can't be an insurance failure.

Get a emissions test dun on your car if it has a de-cat pipe on it. It will not pass I've lost count of the amount of cat i have replace throw car failing there emissions test but that will not stop me from putting one on

 

[MickD]

But the question still remains "Will a 2005 car actually pass an emissions test without a cat"

The MOT website also says this:

To decide whether or not a vehicle should have a catalytic test the MOT garage will have an official booklet which clearly states not only which vehicles should be so tested but also what the limits should be for that specific vehicle.

A vehicle built 10 or 15 years ago will have very different limits than a 2005 Trophy. I am sure that the limits on a modern car will be very tight and there is no way that the car will pass the test without a cat.

 

[7MAT]

But the question still remains "Will a 2005 car actually pass an emissions test without a cat"

The MOT website also says this:

To decide whether or not a vehicle should have a catalytic test the MOT garage will have an official booklet which clearly states not only which vehicles should be so tested but also what the limits should be for that specific vehicle.

A vehicle built 10 or 15 years ago will have very different limits than a 2005 Trophy. I am sure that the limits on a modern car will be very tight and there is no way that the car will pass the test without a cat.

I read that section also and its an answer for older cars ( those before it was legal requirement for car manufacturers to fit cats) - the car in question was not originally fitted with a cat but the garage failed it for not meeting today's emission limits.